I have been soliciting effective STFU responses to one particular angle that's been grating on me: the Moral Imperative to Reproduce imposed upon those of us with a pair of X chromosomes and a terminal degree. You know, the "educated women are reproducing at lower rates than uneducated people!" exclamation followed by an accusatory eyebrow waggle in your direction. (Is it just me? Does this happen with alarming regularity to other women out there?)
First of all, who the fuck cares? Is this really a problem on a planet facing overpopulation in the very near future? Is it possibly symptomatic of the fact that some educated women might wonder if bringing more bodies into the world is not a long term solution?
Secondly, even if we assume that it is a problem and that it is apocalypse-smashing-critical that more educated women start popping out sprogs, is it specifically MY job to save the world? 'Cause you know, I'm pretty sure superhero savior is not in my job description. I didn't sign up for this.
Thirdly, if children of educated parents really are some kind of panacea for all the world's ills, why are you going on and on about how educated WOMEN have some unique responsibility to reproduce? Are you telling educated men the same thing? Why not? I mean, I'm a pretty good biologist, but even I have not yet developed parthenogenetic abilities yet.
So in response to this particular uterus-hijacking tactic I propose a couple of smackdown retorts:
- Oh, and how many children do you have? Only two!?!? Well, that's only replacement rate for you and your spouse! You have not increased the proportion of educated people in the world, only maintained the status quo. You're an educated woman; you should have MORE children. And while you're at it, maybe you could have a few for me, since I'm kind of busy with other things.
- Oh, and how many children do you have? Only one!?!?! Gosh, that's below average. I think the average number of children per couple is now 2.3. You'll need at least two more to be better than average. Where does that put you on the curve? If C is average, this earns you, what?, a D in Reproduction? tsk tsk. As for me, I can't fail a class I'm not registered for.
- I also like Zuska's method.
(To be clear, I am not stridently opposed to women reproducing, whether educated or not, as it suits their fancy. By necessity, I am also not stridently opposed to men reproducing, again regardless of their educational status. I am merely stridently opposed to people gettin' all up in my uterus - or anyone else's - because my fancy re: reproduction doesn't suit them. I'm actually stridently opposed to people gettin' all up in my uterus for any reason whatsoever, fancies and suits aside. So there.)
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I just tell them I've sold all my eggs and/or both my ovaries. That comeback kills two birds with one stone -- they can no longer badger you to breed (since you're biologically incapable now that your ovary-less) and you've fulfilled your overpopulating-the-earth-with-smart-people duties. You can up the discomfort factor by appending "I sold my eggs" with "for crack money."
You could ask them if they are aware that not everyone is fertile, and leave it at that.
I've been married for almost 3 years now, and I'm pushing 30. The reproduction questions (among family and a few friends) have sprung up like wildfire. I'm tired of saying "we'll have one when we feel like it".
I guess at least no one's telling me to have 3 just to increase the world's population of smart people.
I found these comments the hardest to take after I had a miscarriage in December. I mean, it always pissed me off that people were up in my business about it (it is DEFINITELY NONE of their business), but then it just hurt too...like I was a failure because I tried and it didn't work.
The only upside was that I could say that I had a miscarriage, and that usually shuts these assholes up.
I totally hate when people do this to me and I am in the same boat as Candid Engineer except I've been married for 8 years and the questions don't get any easier. Luckily, I've convinced my mom to stop asking (kind of).
Sadly, I do have to admit that this post made me think of that movie, Idiocracy, where all the smart people stopped having kids and only the uneducated masses procreated, leading to a dumb society. Bad movie but silly and relevant concept.
Lol Sarah!
CE - I am sorely tempted to take your tack but with this particular individual I don't think it would shut her up - then it would just be a litany of, "are YOU unfertile?" and "how do you know?" and "what have you tried?" and "let me give you the number of an excellent fertility doctor I know"...she has NO boundaries.
Alyssa - I am so sorry for your loss and so sorry that you get these kinds of questions, and that they cause you pain. Also, it is not your fault. You know this I'm sure but if it helps to hear it again...
Someone I was venting to IRL suggested that I snap back with "I had a miscarriage" even though I haven't in hopes that it would a) shut this person up, and b) give her pause before the next time she gets up in someone's business without knowing. It seems horribly insensitive for me to fake that so I won't, not to mention the fact that it probably won't change anything anyway.
In any case, you have my sympathies.
Beaker - Yes, I see the "logic" in this claim...but I still don't think it means I am obligated to produce an educated liberal Quiverfull to counteract the idiocracy. Nor are there any guarantees that my hypothetical children will end up being balanced, rational, educated adults anyway. Children are their own people who get to make their own decisions at some point, and it's foolish to *assume* that they'll be anything like their parent.s
If someone's estupido enough to say that to me I usually say I have better uses of my time. But then again that's the napalm the bridge approach ^^
Not that this is strictly relevant to me as a father of two, but I am a fan of the "not all of us can reproduce." Especially if it is delivered with tears and a haughty "thank you very much."
A male friend of mine managed his mother in law rather nicely with; "oh, Danni didn't tell you about the cancer???"
I do rather like the ovaries for crack money though. Almost makes me wish I were a childless woman...
I am very grateful to my baby sister for taking the pressure off me to produce the grandchildren.
The thing I enjoy most about children is being about to hand them back when the novelty has worn off. As an aunt I can feed my nephews chocolate and return them before they vomit.
Babies are cute and children can be fun - then they turn into teenagers. Why the hell would anyone want a teenager? I would rather take my chances with lion cub!
I explain one thing we like about our cats is that no one makes a fuss when we leave them home alone. Can't do that with a baby!
Children are big responsibility, and there is no shortage of humans, so I have never understood non-family members wanting to sell motherhood to someone who is not already sure they want it.
What really bugs me is how people gossip and probe "do you think she is unable to have children?"...it is not like they even care for the right reasons!
Unfortunately, once you have one the questions begin about when you'll have the SECOND one. And let me tell you, our decision to wait several years between kids does not sit well with the folks who ask. Supposedly I should be preggers RIGHT NOW, not waiting another two years. Because there is only one correct birth spacing, and if you don't hit it just right your kids will become sociopaths (and who knows if I dared to say, maybe we will just stick with the one. I would probably be hanged).
Ugh, I hear ya. It's amazing how being a living, breathing woman is all it takes for ANYONE to feel it necessary to comment about how you should have children. Not, "You're so wonderfully patient and great with kids, you should have children." or anything like that, no, merely, "You're a functional adult capable of reproducing and in case you somehow weren't aware of that I'd like to remind you."
About your third point, it would certainly be interesting to turn that around by insisting, for example, to educated men that they must adopt troubled foster children to spread their genius and cure society.
Educated women are reproducing slower... we should panic because ideas can't spread themselves through any means other than biology and indoctrination!
Another thing that really bugs me is the how it is implied that educated women will produce educated children because of genetics.
I am not convinced it is about genetics. It is about money and culture. Intelligence and education are not synonymous, and enough money can educate the dumbest child.
The same results (a more educated population) would come about by educated women sponsoring and/or mentoring a children born to less affluent/educated parents.
Hear, hear.
I need to figure out what to say to my parents, although for now being unemployed means I can say we couldn't afford children even if we wanted them.
Mostly I think of nasty things to say about how I come from a long line of women who never should have had children and it stops with me.
blame the women. and then blame the educated women some more....
I could rant for hours, but I'll stop with "I've been in family land for two weeks now and it is not getting more fun with the more family I meet". I think the best comment so far was "oh, Do I et to see you now because you are about to tell me you are pregnant?" well... ehh.. no? I just wanted to meet family. And I am above 30 years old... I guess that solves it in their heads?
It's gotten better since I passed the age of 40...
Though, having been single since my mid-20s, it's always a painful question - not sure I wanted kids, but I didn't really have the choice as I never found a man interested in me - and neve got quite desperate enough to seriously explore a solo option.
And let me tell you, our decision to wait several years between kids does not sit well with the folks who ask.
Fuck that bullshit Kate - I can attest to just how fanbloodytastic it is to have a fair distance beween them - if more than one is what you ultimeately want. Mine are 8 and 2 - and I cannot imagine that either would have survived the experience if we had done the batshit insane "one right after the other."
And you know what - one is enough, if that is what you want. None is a really fantastic idea if that is what you want. Were I not such a lazy bastard about getting the snip (which I finally have) I would have stopped with one. Honestly, if the bastard doctors would have let me get snipped when I first wanted to I would have done better by my (at that point) potential children. They refused (I was twenty) and while I don't regret being a parent, I do think my eldest would have been better off with parents who could really afford to really offer him the opportunities that I believe children deserve adn which I cannot afford - though believe me, I do everything I can.
Screw these bastards that moralize and virtually deify parenting. Most any assholes can screw, it isn't fucking special. Mostly it is hard work and if you care about your child, sacrifice. It is not for everybody and honestly, we need more people abstaining from reproduction - not less.
Someone I was venting to IRL suggested that I snap back with "I had a miscarriage" even though I haven't...
Before I had the miscarriage, I always wanted say something like that (I had a miscarriage, or was infertile, or had cancer, etc.), but now having gone through it, I can see how it would be really insensitive to do so. I'm glad you haven't gone that route, even though it would a) feel good to put someone in their place and b) probably work to shut (most) people up.
Unfortunately, human beings are just nosy in general, and we have to learn to deal with it. If it's not children, it's your job, or your love life, or your hobbies - people just need to know why others do certain things, especially if it's not the way they (or people in general) do them :S
Honestly, if this is someone at work, I would tell them that's a private matter and leave it that that. You shouldn't have to think of comebacks.
Speaking of people at work, I have a labmate who has forever been predicting that I will have kids soon because I am the oldest female in the lab and the previous older-than-me member left and had kids. My uterus is not your business, pal! He's a nosy ass in general so I just tend to ignore him and count the days until he leaves.
And for clarification, I don't agree with the concept of the idiocracy movie. Trust me, I wholeheartedly agree with you that smart parents don't equal smart kids and we aren't required to procreate. It's shameful that women are pressured so much to have kids and if we do, we are then further guilted because we have to now take care of those children and juggle a career.
Honestly, if this is someone at work, I would tell them that's a private matter and leave it that that. You shouldn't have to think of comebacks.
*Shouldn't*, it's true. However, this person has no sense of personal boundaries and gets all offended and shit when I try to enforce some...which then turns into a 3-ring passive-aggressive circus. I wish I could just say fuck it, I really don't care if I piss this person off by laying some ground rules in our professional relationship, but I have some vested interest in keeping the peace since we share an office. Have run through some strategies with other people that know her better and consensus is that I am best served by just shutting up and putting up - addressing it directly is very likely to lead to an escalation of hateful drama. Fuck me.
*hugs for AA* :(
Grad student very kindly invited me to move my workspace into her office since there is extra desk space there. I'm fairly certain though, that choosing to move into a less up-in-my-uterus work area would be taken as a personal affront by my current office mate who will then hate me for not liking her. It would appear that I just can't win this one.
I feel so sorry for you. I'm lucky that its only my family that questions me and I have NO issue telling them to Fuck off!
Thought Mr.SM's maternal grandmother did put the question to me (after 5 years of marriage and no kids). I just said that Mr.SM didn't want kids and as a good indian wife I wasn't going to argue with him. <--- Mr.SM hit the floor laughing when he found out and siad that, but agreed to say that he didn't want children. Grandmama of course, didn't have the guts to say anything to him. Hahaha
OMG SM that might just work!! The person who has been doing this also seems to have very traditionalist views about marriage and male-female relationships. Even though I am not married (also a point that irks her) it is clear that she thinks my egalitarian relationship weird. Maybe the next time it comes up I'll just say, "Well, BH doesn't want kids and he's the man so I defer to his decisions." That might actually pacify her. Thank you - I will try it!!
Even though my MIL has no issue with defined gender roles, it still shocks me to know that educated women really believe that the man should make the decision. I could not handle that.
However, I have no issue using playing the "good little wife" card if it stops me from having to deal with annoying questions. No matter how unrealistic it is. good luck!
I have to say I get the "but you're so fabulous and smart and awesome, you have a RESPONSIBILITY TO REPRODUCE" ALL the time and it drives me nuts. Some of us don't want to reproduce. Why must I be constantly made to feel guilty about this decision?
I've found that a really good way to shut people up is to say "I don't like children", but then of course they all hate you after that. I do like children...I just like handing them back to their parents when they're done. And teenage years!? At least then they can cook their own food. It's years 1-5 that scare the crap out of me.
H*ll I get that and the question about when I'm getting a PhD*. Then to top it off I hit 30 this year, and people keep implying that I'm OLD, and don't I know risks of having a kid a this age. Make up your f*cking mind and pick a position, people! I'm either too old, I should be getting a degree, or I should have kids, all 3 are almost mutually exclusive. That doesn't even count the people who have heard MY position on kids and just ask DH those questions (and yes, I'm talking to you Mom and Dad, and Grandmother, and various aunts and uncles and great-aunts and great-uncles...). Seriously everyone needs to STFU about anyone's reproductive status.
*as I'm a tech with a BS, but with enough class credits, but not the research for a higher degree.
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